The King Has Returned! (Some spoilers may lie ahead)

[Bruinen]

Sorry, Gareth! I've always had problems keeping you two straight because your avatar looks how I imagine Barli to look.

[Gareth Yaztromo]

Bru, that's ok. I guess he (the avatar) kind of does look like Barliman. However it is the wizard Gareth Yaztromo from the fantasy game book series Fighting Fantasy, which you may have not read/played before.

[Oromë]

Sadly, Gareth, the Druedain were not in the movie, though I was so amazed by everything else that I didn't notice their absence until I read your post.

[Gareth Yaztromo]

Orome, that is sad indeed. Prehaps the EE. Because I have read about them filming Druedain scenes. How was the fate of the ring tied to Arwen's life? *shudders at change*

[Maedhros]

The way I interpretted Arwen's life being tied to the ring was just that now she was mortal and every mortal was tied to the ring. It was just a more poetic way of saying it. I don't think that she was literally going to die the second Sauron got the ring, but just like everyone else who was mortal she would die eventually if it were not destroyed and Elrond was worried about this because he was going to be leaving with all the other elves.

[_Legolas_]

Of course the Legolas "I'll take out the tower and then bring down an Oliphaunt, and then gracefully slide off it's trunk while getting shot at" scene was a bit much, but Gimli's reaction was priceless.

Well, we always expected Legolas to do great things....he is the elf-action hero-most good looking person in the film after all. (sorry tings) One thing though, can you (orome or anyone else un patronising) explain

* when did legolas take down a tower?!?! how? saw it today btw oops

*who are the corsairs? the evil people on ships? and why didn't they turn up aragorn and dead ppl ate them?


ok hates and likes:

LIKES:

must agree with everyone here, Pippins song was breathtaking, best song ever! he really can sing, i agree tings, and it was about fading hope wasn't it? something along those lines.......and yeh it made me weep.

All the wicked stuff that legolas got up to......even though they didn't make more of the 'lets count how many baddies we kill' thing so it was just straight in with the 'that one counts as one!' jokes. funi btw.

yup, the bowing thing was kinda cool.

the creepy bit where shelob kinda hovers menicingly over frodo.......made me shiver......and also the look on frodo's face (good acting i mean) when the sting takes him. just looked so real.

evil frodo...hahahahah!!!!! and the bit where his finger came off....just ouch.

oooo! the bit where frodo, sam, merry and pippin come riding into the shire with their uniforms on (merry and pippin looking quite tasty!) the looks on their faces just made me laugh.

sams loss of weight ...or was it just me? also looking a lot healthier and the happiest ive seen that character in all the films. (hahaha duh...but still.)

Eoywn fighting the witch king.....and ducking that scary looking lump of metal, and looking after merry.

The galadriel helping frodo up...cool or what!? Especially as he kinda springs off the ground-nice.

DISLIKES:

Arwen dying? And Elrond practically flew there to tell Aragorn, when it took the others like half a year to walk.

They cut sam's elvish outcry and the blinding, if im correct, of shelob by that light. I loved that cry in the books! I was waiting for a dramatic climax with the light and a subtle falshback of galadriel but didnt happen. dissapointing.

The whole-Eowyn dead....Eowyn alive! yay! thing. same with farami. we guys knew what was happening but everyone else....!?!?!?!?

The ending was a bit lame......and yes whoever said that-i was expecting a kiss on the lips! he just looked as if he was about to!!!

I wanted to see sam go up to Rosie. we have hardley heard her speak to sam at all?!!?!?

I would have liked to see baby frodo...hehehehehe.

The composing was a bit rushed I think, and the annoying thing about the Rohan tune, he tried to change it subtly..ie new film.....and it just sounded unbalanced as he just changed the rhythm and added a coupla wierd notes at the end.

enough moaning? i think so. not dissapointing, but the ending was messy and i still hold to the fact that the best film for me will always be the first one, what a masterpiece. Aragorn looked older, and not as sexy. *sigh dammit. Remembered to brush his hair though for the very end (well done aragorn)



p.s if ive said anything wrong I didnt mean to correct me please

[Oromë]

* when did legolas take down a tower?!?! how? saw it today btw oops

I was talking about when he cut off the support ropes and the battle tower on the Oliphaunts back fell off.

[Legolas fan]

I must say I had quite a few "cry" moments, especially during Pippin's song and about the last half hour of the movie.

Oh, going along the lines of Frodo kissing Sam on the lips, when Sam was giving his speech about marrying Rosie, I was half-expecting Frodo to say, "And I've always wanted to marry you, Sam." Or something like that. I don't know why- it just popped into my head at the time.

I loved the lighting of the beacons- that was just awesome! And of course Eowyn's defeating of the witch king. And the line "For Frodo." And the bowing to the hobbits. And a whole lot of other stuff.

When Frodo gets stabbed by Shelob, did anyone else think that the face and sounds he made were the same as when he's stabbed by the cave troll?

I can't wait to see it again!

[gwahir]

Just seen it for the second time already. Even with all the obvious parts left out what was in was awesome.......especially when the rohirrim arrive at the battle of pelennor fields, the oath breakers, and even the short scene with the eagles. It does leave you wanting more I suppose. But now we have the extended version to look forward to but after that? what next? It really was emotional. You really got to see how Frodo suffered.I will definitely be viewing it a third time very soon. hope everyone has had a chance to see it, it should rake in the oscars this time.

[Oromë]

I just saw it for the second time as well, and it was still amazing. I saw Tolkien's grandson this time. He's in full Gondorian armor and they zoom in on his face twice. If you look closely, when the Eagles come, one of the Nazgul falls off of his Fell Beast and plummets into the midst of the army.

[Gareth Yaztromo]

Maedhros, thanks for the interpretation. It is a vague "around the way" way of linking the ring with the fate of the world I guess... still... *mutters something under his beard*

Just 4 more days and I will get to see it. Australia behind again.

[ThingolOfDoriath]

I just saw it for the second time as well, and it was still amazing. I saw Tolkien's grandson this time. He's in full Gondorian armor and they zoom in on his face twice. If you look closely, when the Eagles come, one of the Nazgul falls off of his Fell Beast and plummets into the midst of the army.

*makes note of it for next viewing*

Hm...I seem to recall a news-article several years back where Christopher Tolkien complaining openly on one of his relatives for cooperating with PJ on the set. Could this cameo-Tolkien be the one?

[gwahir]

I just saw it for the second time as well, and it was still amazing. I saw Tolkien's grandson this time. He's in full Gondorian armor and they zoom in on his face twice. If you look closely, when the Eagles come, one of the Nazgul falls off of his Fell Beast and plummets into the midst of the army.

Funny but I didn't see that the first time either but did the second time. It was visually stunning, spectacular, beautiful etc,etc. but still leaves one wanting more. Anyone else feel that way?

[Elindros]

Funny but I didn't see that the first time either but did the second time. It was visually stunning, spectacular, beautiful etc,etc. but still leaves one wanting more. Anyone else feel that way?

I would definitely have to say that it does leave you wanting a lot more. Some of the things that should definitely be in the Extended cut:

-Easterlings (why show them in TTT if they're not in ROTK?)

-Sam and Frodos journey through Mordor needs to be shown as a more difficult one (I agree that for the theatrical cut there are time constraints, but it only takes like 5 minutes)

-Aragorn and army would then need to take a lot longer to get to the Black Gate

-in movie time, the extending of the Mordor journey of Frodo and Sam could be done by intercutting the following things: the finding of Eowyn and Theoden on the battle field (Eomer is crying like that because of Gamling? ... come on, that makes no sense), Merry being half carried into the White City and up to the Houses by Pippen, Aragorn healing peeps and showing that he is the true king, Faramir/Eowyn romance, etc.

-Saruman will be back, this we know already

-more explanation of the Palantirs, and include Denethor's palantir, giving a reason for his madness and dispair

-with the above, include Denthor's "Pride and dispair" speech, looking back I was sorely disappointed that this was not in the films as it is one of my favorite speeches, and is great character building for Denethor

-eliminate the close up shots of Denethor's mouth when Faramir and co. are riding to their doom. Honestly, what is that?

That's about all I can think of for now. More to come as I think of them

[gwahir]

I agree with you El, the list is long. But don't get me wrong I really enjoyed the movie very much. But it just left an empty feeling. We have all read the books so we thought we new what to expect. I imagine those that saw the movie, that did not read the book might get the feeling like pieces missing from a puzzle I would think.

[Oromë]

-eliminate the close up shots of Denethor's mouth when Faramir and co. are riding to their doom. Honestly, what is that?

It was to make him seem more insane. He's disgustingly stuffing his face at the moment his son rides to his death. It gives the impression he doesn't care at all.

[Elindros]

It was to make him seem more insane. He's disgustingly stuffing his face at the moment his son rides to his death. It gives the impression he doesn't care at all.

I don't think that this was the best way to convey the fact that Denethor is insane. Overall, I agree with a post in another thread that the characters of Faramir and Denethor are not brought out very well (in the theatrical versions), this is another reason that I cannot wait for the Extended Editions because there will be more character building of both Denethor and Faramir (*crosses fingers*).

[ThingolOfDoriath]

Quick note: According to http://www.imdb.com, the scene with Saruman, (the one that was from TTT and will appear in ROTK EE) is 7 minutes long...

Wonder how long the ROTK EE will be

[Elindros]

It's going to have to be over four hours easily, putting the total time of the trilogy to around 12 hours. *laughs heartily with glee*

I am going to need to get myself a 6 disk DVD player so that I can watch all 3 of them without having to get up. *proves he's a lazy fool*

[SHIZ]

Quick note: According to http://www.imdb.com, the scene with Saruman, (the one that was from TTT and will appear in ROTK EE) is 7 minutes long...

Wonder how long the ROTK EE will be

I hope the Gandalf vs. Saruman battle of wits at Orthanc is included. I loved Saurman getting bent over in the battle of words.

[bd1976]

Major problems with the movie:

Why did Frodo have to push gollum into the fire?

Why were the men of Rohan so ungrateful to Gondor after all that Gondor has done for them?

Who made saron into a lighthouse?.. surely mt. doom doesn't present that much danger to local shipping!

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On a more minor note does anyone else agree that Aragorn is just a little to greasy to be the king?

[Bruinen]

couple of things:

i think the denethor stuffing his face thing was a comparison rather than a contrast: one man stuffing his face with flesh while other men are being slaughtered.

why sauron's eye represnted as a light when he only brings darkness to the world?

Where does Legolas get all his arrows?

[Oromë]

Major problems with the movie:

Why did Frodo have to push gollum into the fire?

Why were the men of Rohan so ungrateful to Gondor after all that Gondor has done for them?

Who made saron into a lighthouse?.. surely mt. doom doesn't present that much danger to local shipping!

On a more minor note does anyone else agree that Aragorn is just a little to greasy to be the king?

1) Because the audience might have found it stupid if Gollum got too giddy and stumbled into the Crack of Doom.

2) I have to agree with you as the Rohirrim should be grateful that Gondor even let them live there in the first place. I guess since we hadn't seen them helping out much in the movie. Though that doesn't really explain it.

3) Um... pass

4)He cleaned up pretty nice though.

Bruinen, didn't Legolas steal arrows of the dead bodies? I seem to remember that from he books.

[ThingolOfDoriath]

Crap! I just saw an interview with PJ and he said the ROTK EE version will be around 30 mins longer...

[Bruinen]

Crap! I just saw an interview with PJ and he said the ROTK EE version will be around 30 mins longer...

...which puts it at about 4 hours...so I don't see the problem.

[ThingolOfDoriath]

Crap! I just saw an interview with PJ and he said the ROTK EE version will be around 30 mins longer...

...which puts it at about 4 hours...so I don't see the problem.

I'd rather seen MORE then 30 mins, just like the TTT EE was 40 mins, I wouldnt have minded even more material for ROTK.

[Bruinen]

right...but i bet they get started and find that it ends up at five hours.

[Tingilinde]

the original cut of ROTK was six hours. im still holding out for 5 at least

[Elindros]

From an article on TORN:

Peter Jackson said the following at the Copenhagen premiere. Basically he commented that the first cut of Return of the King had a running time of four hours and fifty minutes. When asked why this was too long for theatres but acceptable for DVD, he said:

"It is different with the DVD version. People watch it at home. They can lay on the couch or spread the experience over two or three nights. That is the amazing thing with DVD. It gives a whole new dynamic and I can assure you that the DVD version of Return of the King will be longer than 4 hours and 50 min."

Unless any of our Danish readers have can confirm this then it is still rumour, however if true, this really is interesting news.

My note: Also note that Sir Ian McKellen (Gandalf) appeared on Jonathan Ross Friday night, and he said that the Extended Edition would be over five hours long.

Andy

[Source: DVDAnswers.com]

If this is true then it is the greatest thing I have ever heard. If not, there are only two things that I hate: people who are intollerant of other people's cultures ... and the Dutch.

[Arthedain]

OH MY GOD!!!!!!!!!!!! I missed Narya at Gandalfs finger *cries*
I thought that it was bad of PJ not to show is ring, but I missed it *&/%*(%¤¤#

[gwahir]

OH MY GOD!!!!!!!!!!!! I missed Narya at Gandalfs finger *cries*
I thought that it was bad of PJ not to show is ring, but I missed it *&/%*(%¤¤#

You could see it on his finger at the gray havens.....and speaking of the gray havens I thought that Celeborn did not go according to the book when the ringbearers went but that he stayed in middle earth awhile before finally tiring and leaving.Anyone remember that?

[ThingolOfDoriath]

OH MY GOD!!!!!!!!!!!! I missed Narya at Gandalfs finger *cries*
I thought that it was bad of PJ not to show is ring, but I missed it *&/%*(%¤¤#

You could see it on his finger at the gray havens.....and speaking of the gray havens I thought that Celeborn did not go according to the book when the ringbearers went but that he stayed in middle earth awhile before finally tiring and leaving.Anyone remember that?

Yer right, he did remain in Middle-Earth. But my guess of why he left in the movie is that it prolly wouldnt make much sense for non-readers why Galadriel leaves and Celeborn remains. Had there been time for a narrative of some sort then they might have squeezed it in.